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My next guest is a tech entrepreneur and investor with an eye toward making the world better. For years he’s been at the forefront of tech revolutions and among the first to recognize value. He’s been an investor in dozens of startups, including 40 unicorns. Those are companies worth at least $1 billion. Companies that come to mind include OpenDoor, Instacart, HubSpot, Patreon, Fiorn, and Coinbase.Not to mention he was the co-founder of Reddit and more recently has been investing aggressively in women’s sports. Today he is with me at Invest to discuss the biggest tech revolution of them all. That is AI 776 founder and Reddit co-founder Alexis Ohanian joins me now. Alexis, so great to see you again. We’ve been talking about AI for this whole event today, almost 8 hours of this thing. At the same time, we’ve seen AI stocks hammered for really the second straight day. Where, where are we at in the AI cycle?
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Oh boy, look, I think everyone is realizing this technology is here to stay. It is real. Now, I spend my days at the earliest possible stages of investing. I don’t spend a lot of time dabbling in the public markets, so I, I can’t speak to those valuations, but the bigger trend is very real, the innovation, the efficiencies that we’re seeing, uh, you know, a simple example like writing code, it’s something that I had to.You know, teach myself when I was in high school, um, you know, the act of writing code has gotten so enhanced thanks to this technology that it’s, it’s changed the way apps are getting created. Uh, and so if you just look at that one very, very, very specific use case that obviously has a lot of value in the world, right? We can’t live without software. Um, we can see the implications for this. And so,You know, I can’t speak to those public market evaluations. I’m still long term very bullish on the overall technology trends, and I think one area where we’ve seen growth in the private portfolio has been around uh infrastructure related investments. And so companies that are building on the, the hardware side, on the, the, in the world of atoms, uh but atoms that are in support of the bigger needs we’re gonna have around energy.Compute and just excited to see that. I think a lot of this technology can help us live much better lives and that’s the kind of thing we want to getbehind.
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Alexis, you, you’ve been early on so many things in technology. Take us through where you’re seeing opportunity right now like at the ground floor. I imagine things you’re looking at right now may come to fruition 5, 10 years down the line.
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Yeah, I mean, you know, I could speak to Vibe Coding, we, we, we see a company literally called Vibe Code, uh that has really focused on mobile first, you know, iOS and Android first app development, uh, literally from a text prompt, like my dad could within a few minutes build an app to solve some problem he has, you know, they, they really believe the founders do that software development will get incredibly commoditized and, and that access to creating useful software, especially on your mobile device.Uh, will just look and feel fundamentally different than how I was taught as a kid or how generations of developers were taught.And, and that, that feels very inevitable and actually feels like a shift we’ll see in the next 5, 10 years. On the really extreme end, um, my partner Caitlin just backed a company called StarCloud, uh, which is aspiring to build data centers in space. They actually recently just put the first one up there on a recent SpaceX launch just last. Data
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centers in space. How, how does that even happen?
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And, and again, so to have, you know, have basically unfettered access to light, so solar power that’s coming through. You still have to solve a lot of problems with heat dissipation.Uh, which again, I’m not, not the, uh, the, the physics expert here, but the, the founders are. And what’s exciting is, you know, if you want to build, and I think Elon recently and maybe even Jeff Bezos were recently talking about the inevitability of data centers in space as a means to achieve these extra levels of a civilization where we get to become a spacefaring civilization and we actually have these needs for compute, uh, so that we can, you know,Uh, whether it’s inhabits Mars, uh, the moon, or any other things that are going on around there, in the short term, right, we’re having enough growth here, building data centers on Earth, terrestrial ones.Uh, but you know, at the far ends of ambition, you have founders looking to build these data centers in space to help, you know, create opportunities for using that compute out there in the constellation of satellites and, you know, there’s plenty of defense reasons, uh, and plenty of just human advancement reasons why this actually could be helpful if, if the science works. Uh, so, so again, we want to be the first check in a range of companies from software, which I feel, you know, quite, quite familiar with.Uh, all the way to, like I said, data centers in space. Uh, this is the kind of ambition we look for at 776, and it’s exciting because, you know, founders are in a way that wasn’t the case when I started Reddit 20 years ago. Founders today are very aware of the power of technology and so many of the very best feel an imperative to build not just great businesses, but great businesses are gonna help push humanity forward and it’s inspiring. It’s a, it’s a, you know, I’m on the other side of the table now. I’m just wiring the money. I’m not.Not building the businesses like I used to and and so it feels really satisfying uh to be close to and inspired by founders who are doing just such great work.
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Alexa, I think you and I are the same age. When did we become like the old guys in the room?
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I know, dude, geriatric millennials when it really hit home. I mean, look, I’m 42. I have two young kids that, that keep me, keep me on my toes. Uh, but it’s, it’s probably the best part of this job is you’re constantly seeing a new generation of founders who have new ideas, right? The 21 year old founder of Vibe Code, right? He’s teaching me about the world and his generation today, knowing he basically grew up on the site I created, Reddit.And has a totally different worldview because technology has been a core part of his entire life. The internet, social media has been a core part of how he learned, how he connected, and, and it’s wild just to see now the ripple effect. And, and like I said, I leave most of the conversations I have with founders, you know, pitch meeting.Uh, daily feeling motivated and inspired and uh it’s, it’s an amazing time to be alive and I definitely feelthat you’ll be
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both, I, I assure you. How, how are the founders of today, the ones leading as AI revolution, how are they different from your generation?
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Um,I think what’s very interesting, and I know a lot of said every generation seems like they hate on the next generation coming up as being too entitled, too lazy, all these things, and I, I’ve, I remember when it was assailed against millennials, when we were the 20 year olds, I, I, I, I, I see it happening. I’m not falling into that trap. I do thinkThe ones who are the, the, the builders of this generation who are really high agency, who are really motivated, are head and shoulders above certainly me and, and our generation we’re building. I think the, the fluency, the fact that they are truly digital native, the fluency they have with technology, but also the fact that they’ve seen a tremendous amount of change, right? The iPhone showed up in what, 2009, 2010, um.Those are all technologies that they basically, they take for granted. That’s just the default standard state. And if, you know, you and I, you know, remember dial-up modems. It’sgreat that I plug
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into
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my
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compact computer.
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Everyone’s handy, you take it for granted. But, but what will really make your noodle is the fact that this generation of founders is thinking about AI in a similar way. If you’re 18 years old, you know, the chatchiBT moment was a few years ago, um, and so you were really coming of age.And you’re about to go to college, and, and now you have a totally different worldview on knowledge because, you know, we’ve democratized access to, to, you know, infinite human knowledge and the tools on which we’re building are only, they’re the worst they’re ever going to be, they’re only going to get better and so.The, the, the gift of that is the founders who are leaned in right now, they know it has never been a better time to be building a company, to be starting a company. It’s never been a better time to be an 18 year old, whatever, 20-year-old, someone who has minimal experience but has really high agency, really high drive, and is very curious. So it is an amazing time to be a founder, far better than it was 20 years ago. I think at any point in the last two decades that I’ve been either building companies or investing in them.And, and I know it feels like there is a big gap. At the same time, we have members of that same generation that are like opting out of work or railing against a lot of that, and I really, really hope that the builders win. I really, really hope that more and more people, especially young people, feel compelled to see problems.And then do something about them, right? Not just talk about them, not just complain about them, but actually take action. And what I’ve just seen, you know, the power of entrepreneurship to be able to just improve quality of life. Yes, build great businesses that hire lots of people, but, but improve the quality of life for civilization. I, I want to see more of that and I, I, I do feel that gap with this generation, but for the folks who are leaned in, it’s inspiring to help.
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Alexis, you’re a, you’re a father of young, uh young children. What is this AI revolution? What will it mean to how they learn, but in addition, what does it mean for that generation, their ability to find jobs 1520 years from now?
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Well, OK, so on the latter point, I don’t know. I want to believe I’m a tech optimist and I do think more new jobs will be created than, uh, you know, removed from the system. I think an easy example, you know, we were fortunate to be early investors and a guy, Mr. Beast, 5 years ago.The idea of being a content creator, let alone a billionaire because of it, was unthinkable, what, 15 years ago, 20 years ago, and now it’s probably one of the most common professions that a young kid, at least in America, wants to be when they grow up. So there is precedent, right, for, you know, social media, that that that that revolution was a significant one, not nowhere near as big as AI, but it was one that created entirely new career paths, sectors, industries.Uh, that didn’t exist before. And with every technological revolution, there’s always new careers, new things that come up that you or I can’t necessarily think of the builders are gonna build and do. And so I’m hopeful there are gonna be more new ones created. Uh, but I actually just in DC with one of our companies, area two farms, so they’re, they’re franchising vertical farming and when they talk about what is needed to manage a vertical farm, especially in a dense urban area, um, where you don’t have a lot of space because it’s more, you know, vertical, uh, it is, you’re gonna have a whole new trades ofPeople who are working on the robotics that help manage those farms and make sure the lettuce, you know, grows on time and whatnot. And so, again, we’re already seeing AI robotics, you know, there are two sides of the same coin, creating new jobs, new opportunity, new innovation, better quality of life, right? Everyone deserves access to high quality, well grown produce, right? Whether you live in a rural community where they live in a city. And so, so I feel, I feel like it’ll be in a positive. That doesn’t mean it won’t be a bumpy road.And you know, how do I prepare my 8 year old and a 2-year old for this? Um, you know, we’ve, I’ve already been paying attention. I’ve been tweeting about things like Alpha school, which I think are taking a really smart first principles approach to education. I do think the future of education for let’s say K through 12 looks a lot more like having guides instead of teachers, where, and that that’s a verbiage from, from folks like Alpha school and Prenda, whereYou know, your, your personalized AI tutor is doing a lot of the instruction, right? If you, I, I’m a big Duolingo user, you’re familiar with that, that is probably the expression of that, right? And, and there’s no reason why a kid regardless of their background, regardless of their home life, shouldn’t be able to get personalized education. So if they need extra help with a certain part of, of math or a certain part of English, fill in the blank, fill in the blank, you’re gonna have AI solve those problems for them, giving them that infinite access and infinite patience to support and customized learning.And then hopefully those kids get to spend the rest of their school day actually interacting and building up their emotional intelligence and and solving problems. And I think the school of the future should really optimize the time with the AI to help learn.Um, but also maximize the time off a screen so that kids are getting the things that are can continue to be valuable when they grow up, emotional intelligence, communicating, empathy, creativity, and those are things that in my opinion, are what really make us human. Like those are the most delightful parts of, of being a human being and, and essentially we have these amazing calculators now that have democratized access to a lot of the pure horsepower of intelligence, which should allow this next generation to focus on, on the more, let’s say human sides of it.Um, but it’s the thing we, we think about a lot. There’s no one solution. I served on the board of Tiger Woods’s foundation, TGR. They’re doing a ton of great work with their learning labs, and that’s an after-school curriculum, but we’re talking all the time about how we can bring AI into those learning labs so that these kids, even when they come out of school, maybe their school systems aren’t quite adopting this new tech fast enough, they can come to these learning labs, spend an hour and get a huge ROI of customized personalized learning. So.I’m excited. I, I, I, I really, I can see firsthand the way these technologies are improving the quality of life for the people I care about and even, you know, if I’m on a road trip, um, or in the car for a minute with our oldest daughter, um, right, I can use AI to come up with, you know, 50 trivia questions that are suitable for an 8 year old. sometimes I put like 10 year old because I wanna push a little bit. And, and now I have a, a quick little trivia game that I can, you know, engage with my child on, right? I want her to understand.That this is a tool that will help her stay curious, that will, that will help her solve problems, right? I want that that growth mindset baked in and, and I, I, I again, I, I just, I can’t help but be a tech optimist in this regard because I can see just how much power she’s gonna have at the fingertips that we could have only dreamed of when I was her age.
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Alex, let me channel the uh sports side of your brain and earlier on today I had a.I had a really good chat with Ted Leonsis, who owns the Wizards, several other teams. His portfolios rallied at, I believe, close to $8 billion. We mentioned the Lakers valued at close to $10 billion. You have been an early supporter investor of women’s sports. When in the world is this valuation gap closed between women’s sports and some of these mind blowing valuations on the men’s side of the equation?
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Look, it’s coming quick. My, my tweet about how undervalued women’s professional sports was in March of 19 went viral for all the wrong reasons, right? Everyone, I, I said this is a massive opportunity. I said I was gonna either start or buy. It was an NWSL team, professional women’s soccer team, and one day it was gonna be worth billions.And, uh, and most people said I was an idiot and no one watches women’s sports, and that’ll never work. And I said, save those tweets. And he ultimately paid in a little over a million dollars for the expansion fee to start Angel City FC and in the wake of that success, right now, it’s, it’s valued at the most for any American women’s soccer team, you know, uh, Arthur Blank in Atlanta just paid, I think $150 160 million dollars for his expansion fee. So that’s, that’s quite an appreciation over just 5 years.And so it has been really validating to see, you know, to call the shot to spark that and, and see the growth, uh, but I think anyone will tell you, uh, it’s just a start. There is so much more room to grow and, and remember, most of these men’s teams value is based on media deals that have been baked over decades. And you know, whereas for women’s sports, when we’re building a team.Uh, I just bought, uh, uh, the LA franchise of League One volleyball, and it’s just like, uh, two weeks ago, so hot off the press and we build out, thank you. When we, when we build out the structure for how to build that team, most of our revenue is not gonna come from a media deal. Most of our revenue is gonna come from brand deals and so we’ve been able to build.You know, Angel City’s doing tens of millions of dollars in revenue a year. Um, you’re seeing a precedent here for more and more women’s pro teams to basically build the muscle of revenue generation in a way that’s much more about, you know, business, right? It’s about how do you drive revenue through brand partnerships and all these things that it turns out lots of CMOs are excited by and the media deal is still down the road.So you have to earn that media deal through the viewerships, but the brand dollars obviously help you build the brand and improve the value, and it’s this virtuous cycle, and you’ve seen that in the rapid ascent of WNBA team valuations and revenues. And I think, you know, it won’t be for every sport, but you can see the places I’ve been investing, obviously also starting a Formula One for track and field like AFOs, and that’s an entire league where I’ve seen this same opportunity that I saw with women’s soccer with the World Cup showed up every 4 years and then everyone was watching and then they all disappeared.Uh, the thesis was simple, you know, why not make sure they don’t disappear and keep investing? Uh, similarly, track and field is the number one Olympic sport. These athletes are superstars and then they disappear. They shouldn’t disappear. So we built Alos and, you know, 4.5 million people tuned in for our New York meet just a month ago, and we’re rolling out a multi-meat league next year with, with teams. Um, so I’m, I’m excited about all this, I think.At the end of the day, we’re only 5 years away, like 556 years from my tweet, and, and, and I think there’s still so much more room to grow in women’s sports. I think we will absolutely see billion dollar women’s sports teams, as I had laid out, and I will be sure to rub that in the face of all those haters on Twitter 6 years ago.
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Last one, and I, I want to say this one, Alexis because I think this is also in your wheelhouse and it’s also in the wheelhouse of my uh dear friends at Yahoo Sports. Why are collectibles having a moment and what is next in this industry?
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It is, it has been an amazing ride. Uh, we love our partnership with Mantle and Yahoo. We’ve got some hobby awards right now actually. Um, I think this industry is starting to professionalize, right? The hobby was always a very mom and pop type business and during COVID, everyone was locked down.Uh, everyone was feeling pretty anxious and nostalgia became really, really desirable. And so that’s when I got back into the hobby. I collected cards as a kid, you know, like a lot of kids in the 90s, I thought that collection was going to help me retire one day. I did not.
17:45 spk_0
Same here. I just found my Batman cards the other night, Alexis, from the 1990s movie. I got a whole collection of them.
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90s, yeah, that’s tough. That’s, that’s probably not worth much. I’m sorry, but.You know, the, the good news is, uh, the card producers are being a lot more savvy with how they’re, you know, the big problems is the over oversupply, right? Supply and demand. I’ll tell you what happens there. So the car producers have been a lot smarter now, a lot more creative, limiting supply, and here’s the way I look at it very simply, collectibles are our generation’s art.And at the end of the day, if I can show you a, you know, Serena Williams rookie card on my desk or, you know, 86 Slier Jordan, right, that, that feels like a flex. That for me, you know, having a Warhol or having, you know, pick your favorite modern or contemporary artist, it doesn’t really do a lot for me. Um, but if you abstract it away, right, what is, you know, art on a wall is ink or something on a dead tree.And you know, that ’86 Flear Jordan is just ink on a dead tree, but there’s a cultural significance for a generation of us who grew up during the rise of sports, really the commercialization of sports, uh, and, and I think, I, I, I think whether it is training cards, comics, collectible video games, collectible music, uh, even match worn, uh, jerseys and outfits, I think these kinds of culture assets are still undervalued. Obviously, do youDiligence, don’t, you know, ask your wife before spending your entire RRA on these things. But, but very, very important is, and the thing that I really do believe is that, you know, art and, and these cultural assets have always been a part of, you know, sort of the financial world. And you may not, you know, agree with it, right, a crate of wine, a priceless Van Gogh or uh whatnot. And I think this is just a new generation’s version of that same thing.And thanks to the hyperconnectivity of the internet, so sports has never been more valuable, and I’d say in particular, if you think of this AI age, I’ve only gotten more bullish about the value of sports since that tweet in 2019, not just because it’s been working and working well, but because across entertainment.AI is going and already going to upend every other pillar, right? Hollywood, television, all those industries you’re seeing, right, the cost of production is gonna drastically fall. There’s a chart topping song right now that I think is entirely AI generated. It’s a bop, right? But, but the music industry.It’s gonna look very, very different. Taylor Swift, I’m still taking my daughter to see Taylor Swift. That’s a religious experience. Kendrick Lamar is gonna be just fine. But if you think of more vapid, sort of shallow, like one hit wonder type artists, right, it’s gonna be very challenging when, you know, a, a talented producer or a 16 year old can spin up a really catchy beat, one of those earworms, and so every other form of entertainment is gonna be really reimagined because of this technology.But I’m never taking my kids to go see robots play soccer. Uh, I’m never taking them to go see, see robots hit 18 hole in ones, right? Can you imagine the Ryder Cup with robots and it’s just 18,
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but that’s not, we won’t take it, we won’t go there for this conversation.
20:45 spk_1
But it’s boring. And so I believe if we project this out, every screen in our life, right, think of how good the TikTok algorithm is or you pick your favorite social network, they’re all optimizing for that little bit of dopamine to keep us a little bit more attracted.And at the end of the day, this will only get better, and all the content we consume on a screen will be optimized for exactly what we want, when we want it, the way we want it, right? And so there is a dystopian side of this, which is a part of our humanity dies from that, because we’re not here.To be spoon-fed exactly what we want when we want it, right? Our species is here because we’ve done hard things or our forefathers did hard things and overcame them and there’s a part of our humanity that dies if we’re just getting this sort of spoon fed, you know, uh, release.And so I think the last place left, we’ll be able to live vicariously through this, this human experience of like, you know, going back to when we tried to catch the gazelle and like some days you catch it and some days you don’t. It really sucks when you don’t, but you dust yourself off and figure out how to catch it again. It’s often in sports. And, and if you grow up like I did as a Commander’s fan, um, you felt a lot of pain growing up and disappointment.But boy does it feel good when that, that, that support is rewarded with some success. And I think sport is the last storyline that is gonna be left with that is truly like a, a must watch experience for us in this age of AI and I, I, and I, and like I said, robots are not gonna replace it. AI will just enhance the experience. And, and so then think of all the things related to that that will continue to maintain or even increase in value, which takes me back to collectibles. It makes me think like, again, if you’re thinking about it as an investment, and again, do your own diligence.But if you think about it as an investment, that creates a really interesting opportunity for the asset class and we’ve seen it with, with the marketplace alt that I had uh seeded, uh, the growth is just, just, just continued uh uh quite well over these last few years.
22:37 spk_0
Alexis, thank you for doing this. Uh, you’ve always been a supporter of Yahoo Finance. Thank you for making time with us, uh, for this big event. We will talk to you soon. Thank you so much, my friend. Absolute
22:46 spk_1
pleasure. All the best. Love me some Yahoo Finance and make sure to vote for the Hobby Awards, uh, between Mansell and Yahoo Sports.
22:53 spk_0
Thanks, Alexis. Appreciate you, man.